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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Hi Jose,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I was echoing Walter’s comments that what I looked at in the demo is a very easy write (without the polishing), and we both know that we can spend weeks, months and even years in the polishing department. What I looked at was not polished at all, but the functionality was there on what I looked at.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>As you start exploring ASP.NET, C# and SQL Server, I’m totally convinced that you too will be blown away in a positive way. Plus you get all the stuff that filePro lacks…<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>For an example, using LINQ2SQL, C#, and SQL, I can create a non-polished 3 table layout (customers, orders and inventory) complete with relations and have it all wired up, scrolling a grid showing each customer’s order with the inventory on each order in no more than 30 minutes… starting from scratch and that includes creating the connections, database, tables, indexes, relations and the form with buttons to find a specific record and a button to save the changes. And the database can be half way around the world… Also note, that I’m not using a wizard here, so I get to see exactly what’s going on ( I have complete control), which I too need to know.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Also Jose, it’s not all drag and drop, actually its about 30% for me, and most of the wiring up of the command buttons and form controls pretty much has to be hand wired, but the thousands of built-in .net functions tremendously reduces the code that you need to write. Of-course anything out of the ordinary will need to be hand wired also. In the 30 minute session I mentioned earlier, a single short line of code can search the table and display it. Make changes to any of the tables and another short single line of code will push all the changes back out to the database. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>And Jose, have you seen the literally hundreds of .net libraries available from 3<sup>rd</sup> party vendors that is limited only by your imagination?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>>> </span>It does not relate to filePro, hence my original post was properly labeled as OT: <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Sorry, I didn’t see that as I was just echoing with what Walter had said…<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>I’d encourage you to stop by Microsoft’s Channel 9 on the MSDN site and search for “Bob Tabor” as the instructor. He presents one of the best (not boring) training sessions and everything on Channel 9 is free for the taking. Bob was hired by Microsoft to do these videos on Channel 9. He markets these and other .net training videos on his site: learnvisualstudio.net. I am only a customer of Bobs’, with no other connection.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>Stanley<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'> Jose Lerebours [mailto:fpgroups@gmail.com] <br><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, January 09, 2013 2:55 PM<br><b>To:</b> Stanley - stanlyn-com<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: Web based application<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>I find it hard to believe that this could be written in minutes but I will look into it. There are 78 tables, 100s of UDFs, thousand of JS code and CSS not to mention AJAX. Then again, you did mention <a href="http://ASP.NET">ASP.NET</a> drag and drop technology which means that the code is written for you but I like to see it happen in minutes ...<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>It does not relate to filePro, hence my original post was properly labeled as OT: Further, like you, many in the list use development tools outside filePro.<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Regards,<br><br><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal>Jose<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Wed, Jan 9, 2013 at 1:57 PM, Stanley - stanlyn-com <<a href="mailto:stanley@stanlyn.com" target="_blank">stanley@stanlyn.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Jose,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I agree with Walter’s comments as listed below... </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p style='margin-left:.5in'>1.<span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span>There are several web based open source ERP and accounting systems that have years of testing and tens of thousands of sites operating today.<o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p style='margin-left:.5in'>2.<span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span> Inventing a new accounting package to use what I am guessing filePro as the DBMS makes no sense.<o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p style='margin-left:.5in'>3.<span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span>However all along the way you've been fighting lack of everything you need in a database (foreign keys, transactions, concurrency, etc..). <o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p style='margin-left:.5in'>4.<span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span>Become the expert in either using the latest version of filePro that can talk directly to MySQL or using the fpODBC tools in an effective manner. (assuming that filePro odbc is now 2-way, as it used to be only 1-way)<o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p style='margin-left:.5in'>5.<span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span>What you have shown literally can be written in minutes just using ASP.net MVC drop and drag technology.<o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p style='margin-left:.5in'>6.<span style='font-size:7.0pt'> </span>On the other hand becoming the expert consulting firm to turn legacy filePro applications into modern filePro applications does have value.<o:p></o:p></p><p style='margin-left:.5in'> <o:p></o:p></p><p>Item 3 above is so very true and is what eventually drove us away from filePro development. When I started exploring different databases and frontend tools and what they had to offer, I was blown away with the options in a good way. I couldn’t believe what I was able to create with half the effort. <o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p>I see too that you are using MySql and expect that you see that there is no comparison to filePro in terms of anything. <o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p>I’ve been developing filePro apps since 1981 and started the move away in the late 90’s when filePro refused to give us the tools needed to compete with modern apps. <o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p>Making the case that filepro was more efficient in text based apps doesn’t work anymore when filePro’s screen size is so small showing such limited data. Many of us are using huge multi-screen displays today, where I routinely start 4 filePro sessions and house them all on one of my 24” or 27” monitors. I need to control my design surface area all the way to my monitor’s max resolution.<o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p>What I needed back then was the ability to add more fields to a screen, instead of having to switch screens, which is hugely inefficient. Another biggie was super lame memo fields that couldn’t auto format itself… eughhhhhhhh! Then there was the lack of speed, lack of table relations, lack of transactions, lack of security, limited amount of indexes, lack of connectivity to other data sources, and dropdown scrolling edit boxes, plus other things that filePro either failed to act fast enough or just plain didn’t address as it wasn’t important to them, like the 80x25 screens and memo fields. I would have purchased new licenses if these items were effectively addressed. And then there is the huge cost for old outdated technology… <o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p>So, enough was enough, and we had to move on or be left behind… Ant the last thing I wanted to do was to learn another new language, or 2-3 more new languages… But looking back, it took me several John and Karen’s GURU camps, many Guru subscriptions, fourgen and unix journal subscriptions to become productive in filePro over a 3-6 year span. Spending that much time again using today’s tools yields so many more opportunities and solutions for today’s work force (younger generation). <o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p>I noted that you answered someone in a different message and stated your demo was written in PHP and MySql, which begs the question “How does this relate to filePro”?<o:p></o:p></p><p> <o:p></o:p></p><p><span style='color:#1F497D'>Thanks, Stanley</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'> Jose Lerebours [mailto:<a href="mailto:fpgroups@gmail.com" target="_blank">fpgroups@gmail.com</a>] <br><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, January 09, 2013 10:47 AM<br><b>To:</b> Stanley - stanlyn-com</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: Web based application<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='color:#888888'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='color:#888888'>Stanley,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>You agree with Mark that "you like it" or with Mark "that it is a security threat" ???<br><br>;-)<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>On Wed, Jan 9, 2013 at 12:38 AM, Stanley - stanlyn-com <<a href="mailto:stanley@stanlyn.com" target="_blank">stanley@stanlyn.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Agreed !!!<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></body></html>